Author Topic: some Sentences  (Read 6416 times)

Offline mallu

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some Sentences
« on: December 02, 2014, 04:34:05 PM »
Here r some sentences from Radford's
1. I would never have believed it  that he could have lied so blatantly
2. I take it that you will pay.
3. I very much doubt it that he will admit his part in the fraud.              I would like to know that if giving up the expletive 'it' in the above sentences  possible without making the sentences ungrammatical?

Offline freknu

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Re: some Sentences
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2014, 05:06:36 PM »
Expletive?

Anyway, in 1 it would be strange to have an "it" unless you write it "I would never have believed it, that ..."; in 2 it is required; and in 3 it is optional.

Offline mallu

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Re: some Sentences
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2014, 05:15:03 PM »
djr,pls shed some native light in this regard?

Offline Daniel

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Re: some Sentences
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2014, 07:13:17 PM »
1) more likely with "it", both possible.
2) requires "it", because "take it" means "understand", but "take" does not. Note that "understand that" or "understand it that" are both acceptable (probably parallel to (1), with the "it" being a little strange).
3) same as (1).

These seem colloquial to me, surprisingly: usually we get longer more syntactically complex sentences in writing. But for some reason these are casual rather than formal, although they are still part of a somewhat formal way of speaking. I just don't expect to see them in writing at all.

One analysis here is actually pretty simple: it's an appositive use of the CP. "I know that guy, John!" or "This is my friend Bill". It's just that in some cases "it" has become a fairly normal part of the sentence. We do get "expletive" it elsewhere in English, though, so at least some effect of that is probably relevant to why we get "it" here.


Anyway, if you remove "it" those sentences are fine, and most are, except in the case of "take it" because that is a specific phrase. But "believe it" and "know it" aren't.



By the way, note that in Spanish (only other example I can think of) you often get what appears to be an article on 'headless' relative clauses; this could be translated as an 'it':
Lo que quiero es una hamberguesa.
it that/what I.want is a hamburger.
'What I want is a hamburger.'

As far as I know (at least in some cases) just "que" without "lo" is ungrammatical when it's this kind of clause (object clause?).
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